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	<title>Comments on: $3 million for not-very-matic pizza</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/</link>
	<description>Thinking and Linking by Joanne Jacobs</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Feb 2012 04:51:22 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Mother of two SJUSD students</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46158</link>
		<dc:creator>Mother of two SJUSD students</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2009 03:05:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46158</guid>
		<description>My experience with schools in the SJUSD is that, with some exceptions, many teachers and administrators seem to have no experience or interest in planning, making goals, evaluating whether the goal will be met, adjusting course to achieve the goal, or soliciting, assessing, and using meaningful input.  Many also can&#039;t discuss with any fluency or confidence their alleged area of expertise.  Many exhibit bizarrely unprofessional behavior when dealing with parents.  I&#039;ve heard stories....I have my own stories.

They also don&#039;t have a very functional chain of command; nobody seems responsible for maintaining quality work or professional behavior at any level.  Don Iglesias seems to be leading this dysfunction.

My high-school son was shown the news coverage of this issue as an example of something that seemed like satire, but wasn&#039;t.  Ha ha.  Funny, but in a pathetic way.  Only the latest in a series of &quot;what a waste of money&quot; stories.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My experience with schools in the SJUSD is that, with some exceptions, many teachers and administrators seem to have no experience or interest in planning, making goals, evaluating whether the goal will be met, adjusting course to achieve the goal, or soliciting, assessing, and using meaningful input.  Many also can&#8217;t discuss with any fluency or confidence their alleged area of expertise.  Many exhibit bizarrely unprofessional behavior when dealing with parents.  I&#8217;ve heard stories&#8230;.I have my own stories.</p>
<p>They also don&#8217;t have a very functional chain of command; nobody seems responsible for maintaining quality work or professional behavior at any level.  Don Iglesias seems to be leading this dysfunction.</p>
<p>My high-school son was shown the news coverage of this issue as an example of something that seemed like satire, but wasn&#8217;t.  Ha ha.  Funny, but in a pathetic way.  Only the latest in a series of &#8220;what a waste of money&#8221; stories.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46157</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 15:54:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46157</guid>
		<description>Margo/Mom,

you are obviously an exception, but we all know that as a rule &quot;Educators&quot; are seldom well-educated.  The GREs have proven this if there was any doubt - Test scores for all sorts of educators are about 100 points below the average for all takers of the test.  We all know the saying:  &quot;Those who can, do.  Those who can&#039;t, teach.  Those who can&#039;t even do that, administrate.&quot;

As far as I&#039;m concerned, the public education system in the U.S. should be completely scrapped, and most &quot;educators&quot; should be given jobs that they are better qualified for - such as dish-washing (if well supervised).  That educators would feel so superior that they pay no attention to the opinions of non-educators is laughable - but we all know that fools are too stupid to even understand that they are fools.

Private schools in the U.S. are providing actual education (not just better, but actual education), usually at one third to one half the cost per student that is spent in the public system.  That alone says volumes about value for money.

Whether the school system is doing what it is designed to do is another question entirely.  Some people suspect that our current system is intended to actively prevent real education, and if that is the case it is certainly working as intended . . . though not as advertised.  It is no accident that qualified persons are hesitant to enter the field in the public sector:  lack of autonomy, bureaucratic idiocy, social ostracization for male elementary school teachers, and endless &quot;certifications&quot; that are useless and time-consuming are not selling points for the sort of people who are qualified to teach.

Not much for it but to tear down the old - but there is no political will to do what is necessary, and the people who might vote are getting more ignorant every year.  At home I have a couple 4th grade readers from approximately 1880, and I suspect that the average college student today couldn&#039;t keep up with what the average 9 year old was reading 130 years ago.  (There&#039;s no question that the average Educator couldn&#039;t understand those books.)  That&#039;s our educational progress for you.

It sounds like you have a difficult job, so best of luck to you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Margo/Mom,</p>
<p>you are obviously an exception, but we all know that as a rule &#8220;Educators&#8221; are seldom well-educated.  The GREs have proven this if there was any doubt &#8211; Test scores for all sorts of educators are about 100 points below the average for all takers of the test.  We all know the saying:  &#8220;Those who can, do.  Those who can&#8217;t, teach.  Those who can&#8217;t even do that, administrate.&#8221;</p>
<p>As far as I&#8217;m concerned, the public education system in the U.S. should be completely scrapped, and most &#8220;educators&#8221; should be given jobs that they are better qualified for &#8211; such as dish-washing (if well supervised).  That educators would feel so superior that they pay no attention to the opinions of non-educators is laughable &#8211; but we all know that fools are too stupid to even understand that they are fools.</p>
<p>Private schools in the U.S. are providing actual education (not just better, but actual education), usually at one third to one half the cost per student that is spent in the public system.  That alone says volumes about value for money.</p>
<p>Whether the school system is doing what it is designed to do is another question entirely.  Some people suspect that our current system is intended to actively prevent real education, and if that is the case it is certainly working as intended . . . though not as advertised.  It is no accident that qualified persons are hesitant to enter the field in the public sector:  lack of autonomy, bureaucratic idiocy, social ostracization for male elementary school teachers, and endless &#8220;certifications&#8221; that are useless and time-consuming are not selling points for the sort of people who are qualified to teach.</p>
<p>Not much for it but to tear down the old &#8211; but there is no political will to do what is necessary, and the people who might vote are getting more ignorant every year.  At home I have a couple 4th grade readers from approximately 1880, and I suspect that the average college student today couldn&#8217;t keep up with what the average 9 year old was reading 130 years ago.  (There&#8217;s no question that the average Educator couldn&#8217;t understand those books.)  That&#8217;s our educational progress for you.</p>
<p>It sounds like you have a difficult job, so best of luck to you.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46156</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 13:08:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46156</guid>
		<description>&quot; Actually it might have made quite a project for a group of entrepreneurial high schoolers to explore&quot;

No doubt any bunch of high schoolers would have done a better job.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8221; Actually it might have made quite a project for a group of entrepreneurial high schoolers to explore&#8221;</p>
<p>No doubt any bunch of high schoolers would have done a better job.</p>
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		<title>By: Margo/Mom</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46155</link>
		<dc:creator>Margo/Mom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Apr 2009 18:11:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46155</guid>
		<description>Kate:

In education we don&#039;t often do things the way you describe. We tend not to start with the things that we know will work and gradually scale up or improve over time. We tend to leap in full force, with little knowledge, expect miracles, forget to plan for evaluation and abandon expensive efforts that don&#039;t live up to expectations (and carry the baggage of the failure for some time after). We are not about continuous improvement. In fact, I am sure some will offer stories of how they bought a continuous improvement package that was supposed to solve all their problems, discovered they didn&#039;t have the personnel, or training, or commitment or data to implement it and have by now abandoned it as another useless experiment. 

We have reinterpreted &quot;data-based decision-making&quot; as test preparation and ignored the concept of informing decisions of all kinds based on available data (meaning information, which would include in this case the cost, the amount of productivity required to make the thing pay off, the level of training required to produce the product using the machinery, upkeep costs, information about the target market and their inclination to purchase the contemplated product). Actually it might have made quite a project for a group of entrepreneurial high schoolers to explore.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kate:</p>
<p>In education we don&#8217;t often do things the way you describe. We tend not to start with the things that we know will work and gradually scale up or improve over time. We tend to leap in full force, with little knowledge, expect miracles, forget to plan for evaluation and abandon expensive efforts that don&#8217;t live up to expectations (and carry the baggage of the failure for some time after). We are not about continuous improvement. In fact, I am sure some will offer stories of how they bought a continuous improvement package that was supposed to solve all their problems, discovered they didn&#8217;t have the personnel, or training, or commitment or data to implement it and have by now abandoned it as another useless experiment. </p>
<p>We have reinterpreted &#8220;data-based decision-making&#8221; as test preparation and ignored the concept of informing decisions of all kinds based on available data (meaning information, which would include in this case the cost, the amount of productivity required to make the thing pay off, the level of training required to produce the product using the machinery, upkeep costs, information about the target market and their inclination to purchase the contemplated product). Actually it might have made quite a project for a group of entrepreneurial high schoolers to explore.</p>
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		<title>By: KateC</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46154</link>
		<dc:creator>KateC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Apr 2009 04:31:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46154</guid>
		<description>You could hand roll, hand toss, and bake pizzas for far less money than this idiotic scheme.  Besides subcontracting with a local pizza company, the school could have bought Trader Joe&#039;s dough, sauce, and assorted toppings for less and had kids make orders in 1st period, and baked them all by lunch. I can&#039;t believe how dumb this was.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You could hand roll, hand toss, and bake pizzas for far less money than this idiotic scheme.  Besides subcontracting with a local pizza company, the school could have bought Trader Joe&#8217;s dough, sauce, and assorted toppings for less and had kids make orders in 1st period, and baked them all by lunch. I can&#8217;t believe how dumb this was.</p>
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		<title>By: Homeschooling Granny</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46153</link>
		<dc:creator>Homeschooling Granny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 19:20:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46153</guid>
		<description>Lightly seasoned wrote:
&quot;How many of their teachers are out buying basic classroom supplies right now because they’re rationing paper, pencils, and the copier?&quot;

Not to worry. We&#039;ve got parents for basic classroom supplies. It is the least they can do after paying their school taxes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lightly seasoned wrote:<br />
&#8220;How many of their teachers are out buying basic classroom supplies right now because they’re rationing paper, pencils, and the copier?&#8221;</p>
<p>Not to worry. We&#8217;ve got parents for basic classroom supplies. It is the least they can do after paying their school taxes.</p>
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		<title>By: oldmath</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46152</link>
		<dc:creator>oldmath</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 17:12:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46152</guid>
		<description>How well does SJUSD do at the job of education?

It&#039;s not like making pizza is very complicated, some dough, some ingredients on top, toss it in the oven.  Now if the government ever got in the business of making something really difficult, like say automobiles, then we should be worried...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How well does SJUSD do at the job of education?</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not like making pizza is very complicated, some dough, some ingredients on top, toss it in the oven.  Now if the government ever got in the business of making something really difficult, like say automobiles, then we should be worried&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Lightly Seasoned</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46151</link>
		<dc:creator>Lightly Seasoned</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 16:49:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46151</guid>
		<description>Hey, if I made a bid on the Pizzamatic, would they throw in those commercial espresso machines, too?

This makes me furious, just furious.  How many of their teachers are out buying basic classroom supplies right now because they&#039;re rationing paper, pencils, and the copier?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, if I made a bid on the Pizzamatic, would they throw in those commercial espresso machines, too?</p>
<p>This makes me furious, just furious.  How many of their teachers are out buying basic classroom supplies right now because they&#8217;re rationing paper, pencils, and the copier?</p>
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		<title>By: Darren</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46150</link>
		<dc:creator>Darren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 15:55:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46150</guid>
		<description>You suggest &quot;flying pigs&quot; in these days of swine flu?  You&#039;re so &lt;i&gt;insensitive&lt;/i&gt;!

{sarcasm now /off}</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You suggest &#8220;flying pigs&#8221; in these days of swine flu?  You&#8217;re so <i>insensitive</i>!</p>
<p>{sarcasm now /off}</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.joannejacobs.com/2009/04/3-million-for-not-very-matic-pizza/#comment-46149</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 15:53:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://joannejacobs.com/?p=8742#comment-46149</guid>
		<description>Just imagine how many other boondoggles like this don&#039;t get reported.  For each of these magnificent wombats (waste of money brains and time), there are probably three or four that never see the light of day.

This goes a lot towards explaining why it takes more than a quarter million dollars to school a class of 25 kids for a year.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just imagine how many other boondoggles like this don&#8217;t get reported.  For each of these magnificent wombats (waste of money brains and time), there are probably three or four that never see the light of day.</p>
<p>This goes a lot towards explaining why it takes more than a quarter million dollars to school a class of 25 kids for a year.</p>
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