Comments on: Surprise! You're supposed to teach kids http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/ Thinking and Linking by Joanne Jacobs Fri, 10 Feb 2012 04:51:22 +0000 hourly 1 By: Margo/Mom http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38436 Margo/Mom Sun, 03 Aug 2008 19:59:39 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38436 Many states were already moving in the direction required by NCLB before it was implemented. While everyone seems to want someone to provide funding with no strings, there are no funders generally available (including the local voters who approve property taxes to support schools) who are willing to do so. So--talk a good game about how much all this accountability is costing us--but realize at the same time it is necessary. Many states were already moving in the direction required by NCLB before it was implemented. While everyone seems to want someone to provide funding with no strings, there are no funders generally available (including the local voters who approve property taxes to support schools) who are willing to do so. So–talk a good game about how much all this accountability is costing us–but realize at the same time it is necessary.

]]> By: Andy Freeman http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38435 Andy Freeman Sun, 03 Aug 2008 03:50:23 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38435 If the decision is made at the state level, the district's beef is with the state and the state is the one who can't compare two numbers. It's unclear how the district blaming the wrong party (the feds instead of the state) makes the district look better. However, the NCLB thing is revealing that public school folk seem to think that every offer should work out well for them. I wonder if they're that dumb with their own money.... Public school advocates claim that public schools teach students how to think. What part of public school behavior suggests that public schools have significant critical thinking expertise? If they don't have said expertise, how are they teaching it? Surely they didn't take "If you can't do, teach" as a plan.... If the decision is made at the state level, the district’s beef is with the state and the state is the one who can’t compare two numbers.

It’s unclear how the district blaming the wrong party (the feds instead of the state) makes the district look better.

However, the NCLB thing is revealing that public school folk seem to think that every offer should work out well for them. I wonder if they’re that dumb with their own money….

Public school advocates claim that public schools teach students how to think. What part of public school behavior suggests that public schools have significant critical thinking expertise? If they don’t have said expertise, how are they teaching it?

Surely they didn’t take “If you can’t do, teach” as a plan….

]]> By: Margo/Mom http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38434 Margo/Mom Sun, 03 Aug 2008 00:22:04 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38434 Mark--I believe it is both. Mark–I believe it is both.

]]> By: MarkRoulo http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38433 MarkRoulo Sat, 02 Aug 2008 21:20:43 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38433 <blockquote> NCLB is an offer; districts are free to refuse it. </blockquote> Can *districts* refuse? Or is the accept/refuse decision made at the state level? -Mark Roulo

NCLB is an offer; districts are free to refuse it.

Can *districts* refuse? Or is the accept/refuse decision made at the state level?

-Mark Roulo

]]> By: Andy Freeman http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38432 Andy Freeman Sat, 02 Aug 2008 18:39:50 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38432 NCLB isn't an "unfunded mandate" because it isn't a mandate. NCLB is an offer; districts are free to refuse it. Any district that accepts the offer and then complains that it is losing money on the deal is saying that it can't compare two numbers and figure out which one is bigger. NCLB isn’t an “unfunded mandate” because it isn’t a mandate.

NCLB is an offer; districts are free to refuse it. Any district that accepts the offer and then complains that it is losing money on the deal is saying that it can’t compare two numbers and figure out which one is bigger.

]]> By: Rex http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38431 Rex Fri, 01 Aug 2008 16:18:38 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38431 From scrutinizing our local school district budget and talking with the superintendent, it is clear to me that just complying with the procedural aspects (not the educational aspects) imposes a cost not recompensed by federal funding. Our district was already implementing the requirements of NCLB (it's a really really good public school district, in the top 100 nationwide), but there are definitely identifiable unreimbursed changes to meet the new data collecting and reporting requirements. On the other hand, our superintendent is pleased that the results can be used to finally convince some of the tenured teachers that they need to do a better job or NCLB will leave them no choice. From scrutinizing our local school district budget and talking with the superintendent, it is clear to me that just complying with the procedural aspects (not the educational aspects) imposes a cost not recompensed by federal funding. Our district was already implementing the requirements of NCLB (it’s a really really good public school district, in the top 100 nationwide), but there are definitely identifiable unreimbursed changes to meet the new data collecting and reporting requirements.

On the other hand, our superintendent is pleased that the results can be used to finally convince some of the tenured teachers that they need to do a better job or NCLB will leave them no choice.

]]> By: holly http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38430 holly Fri, 01 Aug 2008 14:01:17 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38430 And the sad thing is, Tracy, that many schools either don't have a workable plan in place to protect the kids' physical safety, or don't practice it often enough for it to work. And the sad thing is, Tracy, that many schools either don’t have a workable plan in place to protect the kids’ physical safety, or don’t practice it often enough for it to work.

]]> By: Tracy W http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38429 Tracy W Fri, 01 Aug 2008 08:26:26 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38429 <i>Consider that a big part of that increased spending was in Reading First money, a catagorical grant that couldn’t be used for other purposes. </i> Reading First funds the application of scientifically based reading instruction programmes. What could schools possibly be doing with that money that is more important than teaching kids to read? About the only thing I can think of is evacuating kids in the case of a fire or some other major disaster. I am prepared to say that in schools' lists of priorities, protection of life-and-limb should come before teaching reading. Consider that a big part of that increased spending was in Reading First money, a catagorical grant that couldn’t be used for other purposes.

Reading First funds the application of scientifically based reading instruction programmes.

What could schools possibly be doing with that money that is more important than teaching kids to read?

About the only thing I can think of is evacuating kids in the case of a fire or some other major disaster. I am prepared to say that in schools’ lists of priorities, protection of life-and-limb should come before teaching reading.

]]> By: Bill Leonard http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38428 Bill Leonard Fri, 01 Aug 2008 04:14:21 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38428 Somehow, I hear another version of the same old teacher's union rant here: trust us, and give us more money. What? Be accountable, for anything? But you don't understand. To do that would not be professional... Bill Somehow, I hear another version of the same old teacher’s union rant here: trust us, and give us more money.

What? Be accountable, for anything?

But you don’t understand. To do that would not be professional…

Bill

]]> By: Norm http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/07/surprise-youre-supposed-to-teach-kids/#comment-38427 Norm Fri, 01 Aug 2008 00:29:07 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/?p=5708#comment-38427 Similarly, educators complain about "encroachment," the general fund expenses to teach special education children as required by, but not fully funded by, federal law. This is only an encroachment if without this law the school would like to spend its money more uniformly on every child, not giving extras to the weakest children. I spent 12 years on a school board and never heard anyone suggest they wanted to do this. Everyone favored extra help for the special education kids. In other words, complaints about encroachment were just a desire to have more money in total. Unfortunately these complaints about NCLB and encroachment are not the examples of clear communication or clear thinking that our educators should be providing. Similarly, educators complain about “encroachment,” the general fund expenses to teach special education children as required by, but not fully funded by, federal law. This is only an encroachment if without this law the school would like to spend its money more uniformly on every child, not giving extras to the weakest children. I spent 12 years on a school board and never heard anyone suggest they wanted to do this. Everyone favored extra help for the special education kids. In other words, complaints about encroachment were just a desire to have more money in total.

Unfortunately these complaints about NCLB and encroachment are not the examples of clear communication or clear thinking that our educators should be providing.

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