Comments on: This will be on the test – June 9 to June 22 http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/ Free-linking and thinking on education by Joanne Jacobs Sat, 20 Mar 2010 16:12:27 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Andromeda http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-79603 Andromeda Wed, 09 Jul 2008 09:26:51 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-79603 Hate to nitpick, but your second-to-last link is broken; too many https. Hate to nitpick, but your second-to-last link is broken; too many https.

]]> By: Kelly A. Mezick http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-79076 Kelly A. Mezick Thu, 26 Jun 2008 22:37:05 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-79076 I know when I applied to colleges nearly three years ago, my high school GPA --for the schools I was applying to (all in the South) --was average while my ACT score was above average. It was while I was filling out pages and pages of online applications, explaining personal and academic achievements that it all finally dawned on me: after I was accepted, what did it really matter if I was President of my class, Captain of Scholars Bowl, or a member of the French Club? After I got accepted to all three of my schools, and finally decided on and attended Auburn University, I found the answer to that very question: it all meant absolutely nothing. None of my college instructors know what I made in eleventh grade history or how many extracurriculars I participated in. While it all seemed so important in high school to listen to your guidance counselors and be involved in everything and strive to do and be your very best in every subject, in the end, none of it really mattered. I think schools put so much pressure on GPAs and standardized tests scores, that by the time students actually make it to college, they are completely burnt out by “the system” and might even feel a slight loss at why no one cares they were treasurer of their high school art club. Should we have standardized tests? Absolutely. Should they make or break a student’s admittance or denial to college? Absolutely not. There has to be a better balance in this country than what presently exists. Kelly A. Mezick Auburn University Auburn, Alabama I know when I applied to colleges nearly three years ago, my high school GPA –for the schools I was applying to (all in the South) –was average while my ACT score was above average. It was while I was filling out pages and pages of online applications, explaining personal and academic achievements that it all finally dawned on me: after I was accepted, what did it really matter if I was President of my class, Captain of Scholars Bowl, or a member of the French Club? After I got accepted to all three of my schools, and finally decided on and attended Auburn University, I found the answer to that very question: it all meant absolutely nothing. None of my college instructors know what I made in eleventh grade history or how many extracurriculars I participated in. While it all seemed so important in high school to listen to your guidance counselors and be involved in everything and strive to do and be your very best in every subject, in the end, none of it really mattered. I think schools put so much pressure on GPAs and standardized tests scores, that by the time students actually make it to college, they are completely burnt out by “the system” and might even feel a slight loss at why no one cares they were treasurer of their high school art club.

Should we have standardized tests? Absolutely. Should they make or break a student’s admittance or denial to college? Absolutely not. There has to be a better balance in this country than what presently exists.

Kelly A. Mezick
Auburn University
Auburn, Alabama

]]> By: Test Prep Central · This will be on the test - June 9 to June 22 http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-79009 Test Prep Central · This will be on the test - June 9 to June 22 Tue, 24 Jun 2008 21:55:43 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-79009 [...] Original post by Kimberly Swygert [...] [...] Original post by Kimberly Swygert [...]

]]> By: bd http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-78967 bd Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:53:11 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-78967 Minority students are often at schools where even "A" in a course does not necessary mean master of the material. So it is not surprising that SAT is a better predictor than school grade. Ditching the SAT to increase minority enrollment would be stupid, because College want to pick among the URM who can handle the college courses rather than randomly pick some URM. Minority students are often at schools where even “A” in a course does not necessary mean master of the material. So it is not surprising that SAT is a better predictor than school grade.

Ditching the SAT to increase minority enrollment would be stupid, because College want to pick among the URM who can handle the college courses rather than randomly pick some URM.

]]> By: Right Wing Nation » Blog Archive » Cannon Fodder http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-78951 Right Wing Nation » Blog Archive » Cannon Fodder Mon, 23 Jun 2008 20:22:34 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-78951 [...] universities’ making SAT scores optional for admission or dropping them entirely; today, Kimberly Swygert pointed to this article in the WSJ. Many of the articles about this topic have been of the moaning [...] [...] universities’ making SAT scores optional for admission or dropping them entirely; today, Kimberly Swygert pointed to this article in the WSJ. Many of the articles about this topic have been of the moaning [...]

]]> By: rightwingprof http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-78948 rightwingprof Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:27:50 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-78948 It's simple business. Students = revenue. The more students admitted, the more revenue. Unlike the public schools, universities are not responsible for keeping students from failing or dropping out, which leads us to the dirty little not-so-secret secret: Most underprepared students do not complete degrees. This isn't something you usually see discussed, other than on campus (hence not-so-secret secret). There's always a few hand wringing articles in the student paper every year, and the administration either sets up a task force, or departments do, to study retention, but universities aren't willing to confront the conflict between a more diverse and successful student body and lowering standards, so they don't, and the issue remains as it was five, ten, fifteen, twenty years ago. It’s simple business. Students = revenue. The more students admitted, the more revenue. Unlike the public schools, universities are not responsible for keeping students from failing or dropping out, which leads us to the dirty little not-so-secret secret: Most underprepared students do not complete degrees. This isn’t something you usually see discussed, other than on campus (hence not-so-secret secret). There’s always a few hand wringing articles in the student paper every year, and the administration either sets up a task force, or departments do, to study retention, but universities aren’t willing to confront the conflict between a more diverse and successful student body and lowering standards, so they don’t, and the issue remains as it was five, ten, fifteen, twenty years ago.

]]> By: linda seebach http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-78939 linda seebach Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:48:01 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-78939 Kimberly says, "The College Board website also points out that the results show that the SAT is a better predictor than high school grades for minority college applicants. Interesting, then, the increasing number of colleges who have recently ditched the SAT in order to 'diversify' their campuses." "Better predictor" is not the same as "predictor of better grades." If the SAT predicts, accurately, that a college's minority applicants will do badly, then wouldn't the college have to ditch the SAT in order to increase the enrollment of minorities while denying that it was using a lower standard for them? Kimberly says, “The College Board website also points out that the results show that the SAT is a better predictor than high school grades for minority college applicants. Interesting, then, the increasing number of colleges who have recently ditched the SAT in order to ‘diversify’ their campuses.”

“Better predictor” is not the same as “predictor of better grades.” If the SAT predicts, accurately, that a college’s minority applicants will do badly, then wouldn’t the college have to ditch the SAT in order to increase the enrollment of minorities while denying that it was using a lower standard for them?

]]> By: Casper Poodel http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-78934 Casper Poodel Mon, 23 Jun 2008 13:52:09 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-78934 It is hard to be a fan of ETS. They charge students far more than is necessary for testing in order to maintain a bloated bureaucracy, and many of their top executives have displayed a level of arrogance seldom seen in the world of higher education. However, the SAT is and has been for many years, a pretty good predictor of college success. Not perfect, but pretty good. For many colleges, ACT or SAT scores are a big help, along with numerous other factors, in selecting the freshman class. College admissions personnel understand both the limits and the value of standardized test scores. Therefore, instances of deserving students being denied educational opportunity because of marginal ACT or SAT scores alone are very rare, despite the myths to the contrary. It is hard to be a fan of ETS. They charge students far more than is necessary for testing in order to maintain a bloated bureaucracy, and many of their top executives have displayed a level of arrogance seldom seen in the world of higher education.

However, the SAT is and has been for many years, a pretty good predictor of college success. Not perfect, but pretty good.

For many colleges, ACT or SAT scores are a big help, along with numerous other factors, in selecting the freshman class. College admissions personnel understand both the limits and the value of standardized test scores. Therefore, instances of deserving students being denied educational opportunity because of marginal ACT or SAT scores alone are very rare, despite the myths to the contrary.

]]> By: dr nic http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-78931 dr nic Mon, 23 Jun 2008 13:12:37 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-78931 The Chapel-Hill thing doesn't surprise me. For many years, the school district where my husband teaches has put a limit on the lowest grade a teacher could enter into a report card. They set the limit at 50. Smart but lazy students have been taking advantage of this for years. Even if they do no work during a quarter they get a 50. So they work hard for half the year and slack off at the end once they have enough of a cushion to still pass. It's a joke. The Chapel-Hill thing doesn’t surprise me. For many years, the school district where my husband teaches has put a limit on the lowest grade a teacher could enter into a report card. They set the limit at 50. Smart but lazy students have been taking advantage of this for years. Even if they do no work during a quarter they get a 50. So they work hard for half the year and slack off at the end once they have enough of a cushion to still pass. It’s a joke.

]]> By: Test Prep Central · This will be on the test - weeks of June 9 to June 22 http://www.joannejacobs.com/2008/06/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/comment-page-1/#comment-78920 Test Prep Central · This will be on the test - weeks of June 9 to June 22 Mon, 23 Jun 2008 00:15:19 +0000 http://joannejacobs.com/2008/06/22/this-will-be-on-the-test-weeks-of-june-9-to-june-22/#comment-78920 [...] Original post by Kimberly Swygert [...] [...] Original post by Kimberly Swygert [...]

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